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Making piston rings

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jb_castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos

Post Number: 85
Registered: 07-2002
Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 09:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

A friend brought his 4hp Lockwood Ash to my shop a while back, asked if I could do what's necessary to give it some compression.

Last week I took the cylinder off and to my supprise I saw that it had been sleeved. I could tell that it had been run since the repairs, some wear and light scuffing in the cylinder, honing cleaned it up. The piston had been machined .010" under 4", but the new rings in it were very loose in the lands, nearly .020" side clearance. I trued up the lands .030" over to use some ring spacers I had, but the spacers were for a thicker ring and would have to be machined. These are similar to an oil ring on a modern engine, but designed to hug the piston instead of expanding in the cylinder.

Machining would have required making a jig to hold them. I had a piece of 1/8" cylinder sleeve that measured 4.030", I parted off a piece and cut it, it sprung open about a 1/4". After cutting about 1/8" off for the gap the rings had good tension. For some reason L/A put the locating pin at the bottom of the groove.

No matter how close you fit the gap, when you cut the groove for the pin this is the effective gap, 3/16" on the old rings, compression can leak around the pin .

I placed the new pins on the top. After assembling the engine it had good compression and bounce, starts runs and reverses easily.

I know this isn't the correct way to make rings but I won't argue with success.
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ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 362
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Tuesday, February 07, 2006 - 11:06 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I have used a whole stack of oil ring rails in ring grooves. In effect creating "total seal" rings. It's an easy way to come up with rings after truing up the ring lands on the piston. I usually just remove the ring pin and as yet havn't had a problem with one "catching a port"
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee

Post Number: 966
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 04:48 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

This is a 1913 ad, looks like a good design, never have seen rings like it in an engine.

Wish I was a talented enough machinist to be able to make them ?

Mc1

Mc2
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ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 363
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 06:52 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Richard your add was most likely one of the first of what are now called "total seal" rings.
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee

Post Number: 967
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Thursday, February 09, 2006 - 08:59 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ernie

Here's a much earlier ad, 1907.


W07
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee

Post Number: 978
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Monday, February 13, 2006 - 09:17 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

1915 ad

This looks to be a very sophisticated piston ring for 1915 ?

K-P
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peterogborne
Senior Member
Username: peterogborne

Post Number: 106
Registered: 09-2002
Posted on Tuesday, February 14, 2006 - 07:22 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

An interesting ring type Richard. Manufacture would be difficult. I was fortunate enough to obtain some hollow cast iron of various sizes . I have made several sets of rings ,all have worked well. I just machined them to bore size plus 4 thou. I slit them with a fine jewellers saw and spread them about 4mm. I reckon by using a small electric kiln that I have to heat them and to let them cool down overnight they were stress free. But for best results I am sure you would agree that de glazing the bore is essential.
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee

Post Number: 1033
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Monday, March 13, 2006 - 12:11 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

No-Leak-o Piston Ring ad 1921


NO
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richarddurgee
Senior Member
Username: richarddurgee

Post Number: 1034
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Monday, March 13, 2006 - 12:57 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Peter
I must have missed your post above, just read it now!

I find Deglazing is always necessary to get replaced rings to seat,I rarely use a straight stone hone in a bore unless I run it through to see if the cylinder wall is straight and no uneven spots, the carborundum brush type hones work great for me. On many of these very old engines I use the rings over again and have had really good experience but its also necessary to deglaze the used rings as well, this may get a few bristles up but I find cleaning the old rings in the bead blaster cabinet with standard glass beads does an excellent job, as long as the clearances and spring tension on the rings are OK This process has worked fine for me!
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peterogborne
Senior Member
Username: peterogborne

Post Number: 119
Registered: 09-2002
Posted on Tuesday, March 14, 2006 - 07:13 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Richard ...I have heard that a light coating of oxide [ rust] works like a deglaze. Now that would upset the experts!
I have a show coming up in a weeks time .I am going to take two Stuart Turner engines a 5 and a 1 1/2 HP. I used to have the propellors enclosed in a mesh gage . This time I have made perspex boxes with foam beads inside.....maybe it will polish up the screws!

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