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Kelvin Model 3 Marine Engine HELP

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Adam Cottrill
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 02:19 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi everyone,
I found a Kelvin Model 3 marine engine on the weekend and as its currently for sale im looking at getting it. The guy wants $200-250 for it.

The problem is the cylinder is in really bad shape and it would take a huge amount of effort to rebuild as basically there is no water jacket left.

How ever the rest of the engine looks to be in good shape.

My problem is since these engines are rare? (or so im told) should I buy it and hope I can get a new cylinder for it?

I was hoping I might be able to come across a cylinder here in Australia before I bought it.

In fact if anyone has one of these I love to hear from you.

Below is a link of the engine Im looking at

http://www.sky-net.org.uk/kelvin/petrol/poppet/pop3.html

Kind regards,
Adam Cottrill
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peter ogborne
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 08:00 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

If you can afford it Adam then yes . It would be a very nice engine to have . I do not know of anyone who has one . The price he is asking is somewhat high considering the water jacket is buggered.
Put it to one side and you never know what might turn up .....I will keep my eyes open over this side .
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Adam Cottrill
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 08:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Peter,
thanks so much for your reply Ive managed to get the guy down to $175 so im seriously thinking ill grab it for that.. still pondering.

Basically this is a complete engine except as mentioned the water jacket is shot. I guess with an engine like this (being a marine) there would be ten shot cylinders to one usable?

Are there many about, on the rally grounds in the UK? or even here in Au I went through the photos of the National (Heyfield) rally on Patrick Livingstones web page and couldnt find one.

Patrick more or less walked along each line and took a pic of every engine as we went. I feel that is a good indication to its commonness here in AU.

Also what is different about this engine from the pic I posted is it has a V belt grove in the flywheel (and suggestions on what this might be driving?) and also flat inspection plates with no casting of the name on it anywhere.

kind regards,
Adam
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Robert
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 12:42 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

I had this information in an email from a gent in England who has a Kelvin:

"I believe your talking about George Bergius who lives in Lochgilphead and is the son of Walter Bergius, the founder of Bergius Car and Engine Co. I was speaking to him recently about a 1911 Kelvin I have found."

I will forward the whole message to you and perhaps he can help.
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Adam Cottrill
Posted on Thursday, March 04, 2004 - 06:24 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi Robert,
if you wouldnt mind sending the info over it would be fantastic. Thank you so much.

Kind regards,
Adam
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Robert.
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 12:51 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Adam, I tried forwarding the message to you, but it bounced back as undeliverable. I'll forward the message to poor old Andrew and maybe he can pass it on to you!
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Adam Cottrill
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 07:15 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

G'day Robert,
mate I think my mail box went over quota I got a huge attachment I wasnt expecting (2meg) and it locked out my box

If you would try again my email is removed
Thanks so much,
Adam
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Robert
Posted on Friday, March 05, 2004 - 10:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Done! Perhaps Andrew can remove your email address from your last post before the spammers find it!

note from Andrew:

I removed Adam's email address from the previous post.

Unfortunately spam is a fact of life on the Internet. The trick seems to be how to manage it in a way that is reasonable. I have my email addresses on every page of three websites (hundreds of pages) and I get a lot of spam. I am now using the spam filter within Microsoft Outlook which seems to block about half of it. The rest I just delete, it really doesn't take too long. I find it very annoying when someone uses one of the "authorized reciepient only" services. Sometimes I will get someone asking me a question and when I respond I am then requested to ask for permission to send my email, I usually skip it and move on.
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IAIN
Posted on Tuesday, March 16, 2004 - 09:18 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

from Iain macleod from the isle of skye and now living in australia.spent many years working as a fisherman and using kelvins, great old engines,, wish you the best of luck with your restoration,plenty of parts available in Scotland,,
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russell
Posted on Thursday, March 18, 2004 - 05:03 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

For what it is worth, I'll put my vote in for buying the old dear. It would be heavy to ship around no? The good thing these days is that repairs are so easy with the modern welding techniques. Also people are not above making new patterns and castings. It all comes down to what it is worth at the end.
I have always loved Kelvins even if I have a boat with a Gardner 8L3 and have an admiration for them too.
Buy it and have fun.
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Robert
Posted on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 01:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Just by chance I came across this letter yesterday on page 11 of the September 1993 issue of Classic Boat magazine. Apparently there was discussion of a Kelvin engine in the August 1993 issue which prompted this letter. Rather than spread it all over the internet, I'll pass on to Andrew for forwarding to those interested, what I think is Mr. Bergius' address and phone number.
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Robert
Posted on Thursday, March 25, 2004 - 01:28 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And here's the missing letter...
1
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Robert
Posted on Friday, April 02, 2004 - 01:55 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

And here's the Kelvin Register no less: http://www.lotus-single-seaters.co.uk/
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Adam Cottrill
Posted on Sunday, May 16, 2004 - 05:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

G'day everyone,
well the news is I bought the Kelvin model 3 or affectionally as by those who know Rare As Rocking Horse Shite!!!

It got it home last Weekend with in 15 minutes we had the four bolts of the top of the cylinder and the cylinder off. Ive got some pictures im yet to transfer off the digital camera ill post for you to see the condition of the water jacket I mentioned.

I was so surpirsed how easy it has been comming apart. Inside it looks immaculate rings, pitons cylinder look spot on.

Anyways we put the top in the electrolosis on firday afternoon at 2pm today (Sunday) it was clean. This was the first time ive used this technique and I can highly reccomend it.

At this stage this is the only model 3 in Australia or does anyone know of anyothers..... anywhere.

Kind regards,
Adam
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Chris Dennison
Posted on Wednesday, June 09, 2004 - 12:41 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hello, I live in England and am restoring a Model 6 (twin) poppet valve Kelvin. Your Model 3 is certainly rare. There are a few others about in the UK, few of which run. The problem of corrosion of the water jacket and eventual splitting is a big problem with the poppet valve cylinder blocks. The rust seems to collect at the bottom of the jacket, and combined with the effect of the salt perpetuating the dampness, expands and cracks the block. As long as the crack hasn't spread around to the manifold chamber, then the waterjacket is potentially repairable. I have found it very difficult to weld/braze the rusty material, and have preferred to use JB weld epoxy metal on mine. Spare blocks are non-existent for the single cylinder, of which only about 3000 were built. If you need more information or a copy of the manual, it should be available on Mike Skyner's Kelvin web site. I seem to remember that the serial number of the engine is stamped on the side of the magneto plate. The engine can be dated from this.
Good luck with your restoration. It will certainly be worthwhile. If you need any dimensions of parts etc, please contact me,
Kind regards,
Chris Dennison. (UK)
C(underscore)J(underscore)Dennison(at symbol)Hotmail.com
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robert
Senior Member
Username: robert

Post Number: 180
Registered: 07-2003
Posted on Friday, July 01, 2005 - 12:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Any Kelvin owners who need a manual for their engines can email me and I will pass on the number of man in the UK who has a number of Kelvin manuals for sale.
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kenneth macdonald
Visitor
Posted on Friday, September 07, 2007 - 03:22 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi all ,just found the form and would like to join. I run three kelvin poppets on trailers round the island,3 1/2, 6/7, 12/14 and I am doing up another 6/7 at the moment,I didn't know anybody else was interested in them,It would be good to swap problems and how they were over come hope this gets through,just started learning computer,,cheers ,,all the best,,kenny
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tracey webb
Visitor
Posted on Friday, June 12, 2009 - 04:02 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

hi robert

do you still have the contact details for the man who has the kelvin manuals please.

thanks, tracey
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muileachmor
Visitor
Posted on Friday, September 16, 2011 - 08:03 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hi to all,regarding old Kelvin stuff, there are two guys in Glasgow, trading as Seaward Engineering,one or both of whom worked for Kelvin @ Dobbies Loan. I know they had a lot of parts for obsolete Kelvins, and, more importantly,original patterns. They are in a yard off Pollockshaws Road. Andy Bruce and John Dick, theyre getting on a bit, but still spannering away as far as i know.}}}
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robert
Senior Member
Username: robert

Post Number: 443
Registered: 07-2003
Posted on Saturday, September 17, 2011 - 11:05 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Good tip muileachmor, here's the address I think:

Seaward Engineering´╗┐
974 Pollokshaws Road
Glasgow
G41 2HA

Phone: 0141-632 4910 (drop the first zero if calling from outside the UK)

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