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More Atwater Kent

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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1870
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Sunday, September 21, 2014 - 12:49 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Did some digging and measurements on some Atwater Kent Ignition stuff.
Here is what I found:

Switch on the left is START. Pressing this will make a spark starting the engine if it is at TDC with the combustion chamber full of air/fuel mixture.

Switch on the right is ON/OFF

Terminals on the left are POS and NEG or Zinc and Carbon
Left center terminal is G
Right center terminal is S
Right terminals are INT for interrupter or simply put the timer

The copper wire from G to almost touching S is my spark gap. DO NOT test any coil without somewhere for the spark to go.

Plus to Minus or Zinc to Carbon with the switch on and the start button pressed .4 ohms. You should get the same result with the 2 INT terminals shorted or jumpered. This is the primary side of the coil.
From the S terminal to the G terminal is 3.89 K ohms This is the secondary side of the coil.







No cylinder distributor cap. Actually just a cover as this is a 1 cylinder timer



Trip arm between spark/s



Trip arm ready to trip

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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1871
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Sunday, September 21, 2014 - 12:51 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

More Atwater Kent info
click here
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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1872
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Sunday, September 21, 2014 - 01:34 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Hooked up to 6 volts the amp draw is about 385 ma (milli amps) I had to put the meter in the record mode to get a reading. The action of the Atwater Kent is just too quick to see by eye. My digital scope needs a battery so I can't get an actual waveform and dwell time.
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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1873
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Sunday, September 21, 2014 - 05:54 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Searching on the net I found an article Dick Day wrote that was published in Gas Engine Magazine back in 1985.

GEM article
click here

His instructions were to have the wires from the distributor to the coil twisted like old lamp cord. I followed his instructions and it works even better.

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J.B. Castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos

Post Number: 950
Registered: 07-2002


Posted on Sunday, September 21, 2014 - 08:07 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Ernie, I've seen several of these systems, never had the opportunity to get serious with one. I've wondered if you could use the distributor to operate a relay, the relay points firing a conventional coil. If you think it might work and have a chance to try it, give me a report. There's an old Indiana Tractor at Portland that we would like to run, has the distributor, no coil.
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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1874
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 07:01 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

JB using a Bosch relay I get no action from the relay.
1 maybe not enough current flow as the Bosch relay coil has between 50 and 100 ohms. The AWK coil primary has less than 1 ohm.
2 maybe the AWK timer is just too quick

I am going to try it with a modern coil over plug and see what it does.
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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1875
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 07:31 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

JB it works good hooked directly to a modern coil over plug.
In the pic the coil is from a 2008 Mazda3 2.0L
The connections are plus and minus to the coil. The AWK goes from plus to the coil trigger terminal. The white jumper wire is just a ground from the plug body to minus.
This is a 100KV ignition system so it might not work with an old distributor cap and wires. At the least it will find any and all areas of poor insulation. Maybe just use good solid ignition wire and keep the plug gaps close so the voltage doesn't have a chance to get above 10KV or so.

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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1877
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 06:25 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Youtube
Spark gap is almost an inch
click here
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J.B. Castagnos
Senior Member
Username: jb_castagnos

Post Number: 951
Registered: 07-2002


Posted on Tuesday, September 23, 2014 - 08:43 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The Mazda coil is a good idea Ernie. In use I would build in a relief gap, maybe .060" or so then to ground in case someone tries to run it with a wire off, spark would have a place to go.
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Richard A. Day Jr.
Senior Member
Username: richardday

Post Number: 1107
Registered: 11-2003


Posted on Thursday, September 25, 2014 - 05:38 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

Seems to me Ernie has solved the long debated argument that twisting the wires together does give a hotter spark and it probably protects the coil from internal break down.
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Ernie
Senior Member
Username: ernie

Post Number: 1878
Registered: 01-2002


Posted on Friday, September 26, 2014 - 08:52 am:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

The close time on the AWK points is 2.68 ms measured using a digital scope.

With close time this quick the AWK ignition system had a constant dwell time no matter what the RPM.

On old slow turning engines that were running less than 2,000 RPM giving a distributor speed of less than 1,000 RPM.

This was most likely one of the design factors that made this system work so well.

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miro forest
Senior Member
Username: miro

Post Number: 782
Registered: 11-2001


Posted on Thursday, December 11, 2014 - 02:15 pm:   Edit Post Delete Post View Post/Check IP Print Post    Move Post (Moderator/Admin Only)

That You Tube video says it all.
And 6V at about 1/3 A, gives about 2 watts of power.
It makes for long battery life too.
miro

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